This is what i had posted in MotorTrader forum on discussions whether Proton should gulung tikar or not... just sharing my point of view... yes, i drive a proton as well, hence the frustration.
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andrewhtf 1-cylinder Member Malaysia 3 Posts
Posted - 19/10/2005 : 04:58:03
i also don wan to see proton die, but rather, being taken over by a management team that is actually serious in turning it into a quality carmaker and not by just a handful of ppl who only wants to increase the buldge in their own pockets... ironically, these ppl who influences Proton's decision making, doesn't drive a proton themselves, but instead, Mercs, BMWs, Toyota etc...
same goes with the protection and tariff... it should be removed to allow Proton to be able to compete healthily... too much protection makes them lazy... they even have the cheek to continue offer iswara and wira after all these years... take a look at other carmakers who faces competition... how innovative they are in improvising their car yet still offering a fair price for their car.
by the way protecting proton doesnt give us the rakyat cheaper cars, instead we are paying more than we should, all for a lousy car, because we have no choice and being forced to. had it not because of high tax and duty, do u think we'd still buy proton? in other way of saying, this will give proton a wake-up call to buckle up and produce better and reliable cars if they want to earn their keep, and not by forcing out competitors and extort money from us!
why do i say this? bcoz when u are protected from competition in a certain segment, u have the power to set the price, and do u think Proton would be so nice to say "Aiyah, since we're fellow countrymen, i can sell cars to u cheaply at slightly above costs lah"... no... in fact they charged us more, up to a point where people would start thinking, "sigh, at this price for this proton car ah? i'd rather take just an extra few thousand RM loan to buy a Toyota/Honda/Hyundai/Kia..."
frankly i think that the protection has harmed proton itself rather than helping it. i believe, had the protection policy not been implemented, i'm very sure Proton today is a very good and successful carmaker...
Does Proton wants support from the consumers because of Patriotic sentiments or because they produce quality cars? the argument "Buy Malaysian If U're Malaysian" should not be used here... it's such a vain attempt to makes us consumers feel guilty and forced to buy a Proton out of Patriotism. in business, if u're no good, either u improve or u leave. and i dont see any improvement from Proton after all these years... they did expand, true, but did they tackle and improve on even the most basic problem that started from their very first batch of cars? expanding product line-up is not improving. the problem is still there. only if u eliminate problems and provide lasting solutions, u're improving. there is a huge difference to that.
dirtbike, if u think that globalisation is a "soft-invasion" of foreign companies, u're only partly correct. i'd encourage u to read more about Free trade, Protectionism and the effects of Tariff and Quotas on a nation's wealth... u should also read abit about Adam Smith and Ricardo and the theories they proposed.
first of all Proton did not contribute much to increasing our country's wealth, but they did successfully increase our total national Debt! how many does proton exports contribute to malaysia's income. 96% of proton sales are within malaysia, meaning not only there are no money flowing in from outside but merely circulating inside malaysia, but also flowing out due to royalty payments to mitsubishi.
to develop and maintain proton, our country has also borrowed heavily from Japan. thus, instead of using our tax money to build better roads and public infrastructure, they are used to pay off loans and to keep proton (and its 300k workers) alive! that is the reason of what u said as "our national asset are depleting = government less money = utility prices goes up (fuel, tnb, toll, water etc) = no new schools, roads etc = inflation"!!
secondly, by forcing us consumers to buy a much more expensive cars under heavy tax, tariff, import/excise duty (whatever u name it), consumers will have less money to buy other stuffs like ,say, bigger house, the plasma/LCD/Flatscreen TV u wanted, the computer and streamyx, the nice Dockers pants, Armani suits and Gucci bags... if consumers are paying FAIR PRICE on quality vehicles (imagine Vios WITHOUT TAX costs roughly the same as wira/Gen2) we'd have extra money to buy all those above, and this raises the standards of living of malaysian ppl overall!!! take note that i'm saying paying a FAIR Price of vehicle, not underpriced, and definitely not overpriced as it is happening now.
the argument that the government loses income on lower car taxes is a farce as whatever we buy are gonna be charged Goods and Services Tax, so the more money we have to buy stuffs, so the more stuffs we will buy, and virtually the government will have more income as general Malaysian have extra money to spend! Dont forget that active consumer spending contributes to higher economic growth. During the 97-98 crisis, our government actually promotes us, the rakyat, to spend more to jump start the economic wheel! (that is how we get our annual malaysian mega sale, if u dont know...)
p.s :- i was thinking, we already have less money when we have to pay income tax, then when we want to buy something with our already taxed money, we have to pay tax on those again... and what happened to our tax money? well if u'd love to know, go get the Auditor-General's report for this year... i'm sure u guys are gonna fume over it.... cheers!
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so that's my point over the current hoo-haa surrounding our national automobile issues, from "under-declare" to "AP issue", but none of the political big-shot had the guts to say much about the true reason on why Proton doesnt even managed to earn respect among fellow malaysians!
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andrewhtf 1-cylinder Member Malaysia 3 Posts
Posted - 19/10/2005 : 04:58:03
i also don wan to see proton die, but rather, being taken over by a management team that is actually serious in turning it into a quality carmaker and not by just a handful of ppl who only wants to increase the buldge in their own pockets... ironically, these ppl who influences Proton's decision making, doesn't drive a proton themselves, but instead, Mercs, BMWs, Toyota etc...
same goes with the protection and tariff... it should be removed to allow Proton to be able to compete healthily... too much protection makes them lazy... they even have the cheek to continue offer iswara and wira after all these years... take a look at other carmakers who faces competition... how innovative they are in improvising their car yet still offering a fair price for their car.
by the way protecting proton doesnt give us the rakyat cheaper cars, instead we are paying more than we should, all for a lousy car, because we have no choice and being forced to. had it not because of high tax and duty, do u think we'd still buy proton? in other way of saying, this will give proton a wake-up call to buckle up and produce better and reliable cars if they want to earn their keep, and not by forcing out competitors and extort money from us!
why do i say this? bcoz when u are protected from competition in a certain segment, u have the power to set the price, and do u think Proton would be so nice to say "Aiyah, since we're fellow countrymen, i can sell cars to u cheaply at slightly above costs lah"... no... in fact they charged us more, up to a point where people would start thinking, "sigh, at this price for this proton car ah? i'd rather take just an extra few thousand RM loan to buy a Toyota/Honda/Hyundai/Kia..."
frankly i think that the protection has harmed proton itself rather than helping it. i believe, had the protection policy not been implemented, i'm very sure Proton today is a very good and successful carmaker...
Does Proton wants support from the consumers because of Patriotic sentiments or because they produce quality cars? the argument "Buy Malaysian If U're Malaysian" should not be used here... it's such a vain attempt to makes us consumers feel guilty and forced to buy a Proton out of Patriotism. in business, if u're no good, either u improve or u leave. and i dont see any improvement from Proton after all these years... they did expand, true, but did they tackle and improve on even the most basic problem that started from their very first batch of cars? expanding product line-up is not improving. the problem is still there. only if u eliminate problems and provide lasting solutions, u're improving. there is a huge difference to that.
dirtbike, if u think that globalisation is a "soft-invasion" of foreign companies, u're only partly correct. i'd encourage u to read more about Free trade, Protectionism and the effects of Tariff and Quotas on a nation's wealth... u should also read abit about Adam Smith and Ricardo and the theories they proposed.
first of all Proton did not contribute much to increasing our country's wealth, but they did successfully increase our total national Debt! how many does proton exports contribute to malaysia's income. 96% of proton sales are within malaysia, meaning not only there are no money flowing in from outside but merely circulating inside malaysia, but also flowing out due to royalty payments to mitsubishi.
to develop and maintain proton, our country has also borrowed heavily from Japan. thus, instead of using our tax money to build better roads and public infrastructure, they are used to pay off loans and to keep proton (and its 300k workers) alive! that is the reason of what u said as "our national asset are depleting = government less money = utility prices goes up (fuel, tnb, toll, water etc) = no new schools, roads etc = inflation"!!
secondly, by forcing us consumers to buy a much more expensive cars under heavy tax, tariff, import/excise duty (whatever u name it), consumers will have less money to buy other stuffs like ,say, bigger house, the plasma/LCD/Flatscreen TV u wanted, the computer and streamyx, the nice Dockers pants, Armani suits and Gucci bags... if consumers are paying FAIR PRICE on quality vehicles (imagine Vios WITHOUT TAX costs roughly the same as wira/Gen2) we'd have extra money to buy all those above, and this raises the standards of living of malaysian ppl overall!!! take note that i'm saying paying a FAIR Price of vehicle, not underpriced, and definitely not overpriced as it is happening now.
the argument that the government loses income on lower car taxes is a farce as whatever we buy are gonna be charged Goods and Services Tax, so the more money we have to buy stuffs, so the more stuffs we will buy, and virtually the government will have more income as general Malaysian have extra money to spend! Dont forget that active consumer spending contributes to higher economic growth. During the 97-98 crisis, our government actually promotes us, the rakyat, to spend more to jump start the economic wheel! (that is how we get our annual malaysian mega sale, if u dont know...)
p.s :- i was thinking, we already have less money when we have to pay income tax, then when we want to buy something with our already taxed money, we have to pay tax on those again... and what happened to our tax money? well if u'd love to know, go get the Auditor-General's report for this year... i'm sure u guys are gonna fume over it.... cheers!
====================================================================
so that's my point over the current hoo-haa surrounding our national automobile issues, from "under-declare" to "AP issue", but none of the political big-shot had the guts to say much about the true reason on why Proton doesnt even managed to earn respect among fellow malaysians!
posted by Andrew at
1:00 pm
